Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

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Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby Bammo on Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:36 pm

2010 MN Triton @102,000 ks started making a bit more of a clattering noise over the past year or so. Hard to pinpoint when it started. A few weeks ago started surging a bit, especially in the morning for the first 2kms then settled down. Mechanic is currently doing the timing belt as part of the 100,000K service and popped the camera inside the manifold. He reckons its as black as sin in there but no different to normal.

What is different are the injectors. Bear with me here as I don't know much about them but he says the readings from them were really bad - large variation and he reckons they read like 200,000km injectors not 100K. He reckons this is the cause of the clattering noise and cold starts usually exacerbate the problem.

So, is this likely to be covered under warranty? ( I have the original 10year powertrain warranty still active). Mechanic mentioned this is likely to be a $2500 - $3000 job to replace them.

Any thoughts? How hard to push the warranty angle on this?
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby NowForThe5th on Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:59 pm

If your mechanic ahs the gear then get him to do an SQL. This should even things up a bit. Alternately get a dealer to do it (making sure that your service history is 100% up to date) and, if they were to 'discover' a problem they might even offer to fix under warranty.

Don't think so, but worth a try.
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby Four of us on Thu Oct 12, 2017 5:56 am

Lucky you got 100k out if yours....I only got 30k out of my ones...lucky replaced under warranty..
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby har05l on Thu Oct 12, 2017 3:18 pm

I've got 230k on mine and still kicking. The time is nearing to replace them.......maybe


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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby srb on Thu Oct 12, 2017 6:02 pm

I've been told that anything over 180k on these injectors is like playing Russian roulette.. But wtf would he know ay.
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby har05l on Thu Oct 12, 2017 10:06 pm

srb wrote:I've been told that anything over 180k on these injectors is like playing Russian roulette.. But wtf would he know ay.


I've been told multiple times by our good friend don't you worry
Hopefully they hold out till I'm ready


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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby Bammo on Mon Oct 16, 2017 10:13 pm

So I spoke to the dealer today and he said the powertrain warranty only covers the components inside the engine and that injectors are specifically not covered as they "aren't a main component of the engine".

:shock:

So I have been searching online and its bloody hard to find a definitive answer to this question - I cannot find anywhere that states the injectors are not covered - does anyone know for sure?
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby srb on Tue Oct 17, 2017 7:28 am

Unfortunately that's correct, Bammo. They treat injectors as consumables, same as brake pads.

These injectors only have a life cycle of about 200k kms at best. This will depend a lot on the quality/cleanliness of fuel over that period. I think it's absolutely crap that the manufacturers cannot provide better filtration system for this reason. 100k km out of these injectors is not what I'd call good or fit for the purpose imo.. but it only takes one tank of crap fuel to destroy an injector. Anyway you could try pushing consumer law at them and coming to some arrangement? Offer to pay the labour if Mitsubishi cover the costs of the injectors? You could get other work done at the same time like timing belts and valve clearances?
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby gspy4u on Tue Oct 17, 2017 3:36 pm

As with most of the high pressure diesels these days it doesn't really seem to matter what brand car manufacturer it is, they all die o lot shorter than the old mechanical injectors. It wouldn't be such an issue if they didn't cost you a kidney donation to pay for the damn things. Even genuine Denso ones NOT from a stealer cost enough. $1,600 for my prado (dealers want $2,500) and that's only the injectors. Doesn't cover cost of pipes, seals, etc and of course labour costs if you can't do it yourself.

If they only cost a couple of hundred each i could live with that with a shorter lifespan but the prices are ridiculous for the lifespan of them. Just pity those with V8 diesels and the bill for replacing 8 x of them and not 4.
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby Lee-thal on Thu Oct 19, 2017 3:36 pm

i would be more suspect on the suction control valve rather than injectors,
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby RHKTriton on Thu Oct 19, 2017 5:57 pm

I wonder how many parts get changed unecessarially by misdiagnosis?

The ole 3.2 sometimes sounds a bit off so a dose of 2stroke and it literally changes character. :)
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby Bammo on Tue Oct 24, 2017 11:28 am

So dealer reckons the problems are tappets out of adjustment, manifold build up of carbon and a fuel tank full of crap with milky fuel and a blocked fuel filter. He wants $2500 to fix! He then reckons a "clean" of the injectors and an injector re-learn will sort it out.

Anyone have any experience with fixing these issues at home?
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby srb on Tue Oct 24, 2017 12:53 pm

Err.. I thought you said that your mechanic tested the injectors and told you they were RS?

Hmm If your dealer found contaminated fuel and blocked filter I'd be very sus about the state of the injectors. Especially since your mechanic tested them and found them to be RS.

Carbon build up is definitely likely on a vehicle of those kms but it wouldn't be the cause of the noise. They're just guessing on the tappets unless they have physically checked them.. Not a 5min job, valve adjustments (tappets) on these don't usually cause a noise... Is why a physical check of the valve clearances is chosen over an audiable checks.

Before you go spending big $$ I'd be dropping the dirty fuel from tank and replacing the filter then run some injector cleaner and see how if any difference... Also for a small fee you could get your dealer to do a SQL once you've cleaned the fuel system.. If no different then yeah prepare to spend the $$. Cheaper to replace injectors than your whole motor.. Only takes one bad injector to hole a piston.
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby Bammo on Tue Oct 24, 2017 1:28 pm

srb - what I have is two fairly conflicting sets of reports. My local mechanic is a small operator but a guy I have known for a decade and trust. He says the injector values are all over the shop and there is some past form on this - I noted having searched my own forum posts there was a similar issue back in 2012 that others on here suggested was just the dealer trying to score extra work from me?

I don't have any reason to mistrust the dealer...except they are a dealer and have always price gouged at every opportunity which is why I use the local mechanic! The dealers first comment was that the tappets had never been adjusted in 100,000 kms of driving and this is apparently a huge oversight on my behalf. Not quite sure why that is the case? If they were a mandatory check item surely it would have been done during a scheduled service? The dealer has done 4 of the scheduled services on the vehicle, the last being about 18 months ago - local mechanic has done the rest.

I'm leaning towards doing the fuel tank and filter myself on the weekend - how hard can it be to drop the thing out after all! My mechanic has already offered to do the manifold carbon clean for me - again, I suspect its not that big a deal for me to unbolt the manifold and take a look myself first. Anyone done their own manifold?

Then the tappets are a bigger task but can probably wait a few weeks on them...
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby ag9111 on Tue Oct 24, 2017 4:33 pm

Ok you trust your mechanic. Good start.
Get him to take a fuel sample to check for "milky" fuel.
Milky usually means water emulsification and not good.
How does the dealer know a tank full of crap and milky fuel unless they have xray eyes or drained it.
When was you fuel filter last changed. I used to push mine out to 40,000km but have been caught out with a blocked filter before so now get it changed every 2nd service
Tappets are impossible to check by ear and have to be adjusted physical when the motor is cold. Best left to the mechanic.
Manifold can be tricky if you are not confident and is messy to clean
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby Bammo on Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:35 pm

So the dealer provided me with a sample of the fuel. It was in a glass jar and looked clear enough with a layer on the bottom. A quick shake and it turned into a mud [censored]. The amount of grit and crap in there was ridiculous - not water though. I think the problem occurred at the farm refilling with old tank diesel using jerry cans.

Tappets have never been adjusted since vehicle was new - supposed to be done every 30,000km. Not quite clear how this got missed? Manifold is likely to be a secondary issue since mine has been blanked off most of its life. Interestingly, the dealer recommended the resistor mod for the EGR valve once its been cleaned out.

Dealer said once we have the tappets adjusted and new / clean fuel filter they will do an injector clean and re-learn. He mentioned doing this with the scan gauge. Is that something that can be DIY'd?
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby Bammo on Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:40 pm

For those who are curious - the [censored] word above rhymes with mocktail! Seems the swear filter is a bit harsh today!
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby ag9111 on Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:50 pm

High end OBD2 units yes.
Not basic $100 units
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby srb on Tue Oct 24, 2017 6:10 pm

Yeah they say valve clearances every 30k but most on here have found that after the first 30k adjustment it only really needs doing every 80k. Mine has only ever had two adjustments in its whole 160k km life.. getting due for it third now.. Will do injectors at same time at 180k even though it runs sweet.

So back to you.. drain your tank and change your filter, install finer 2um secondary filter, get dealer or your mechanic to do valve clearances, do SQL, will need to be done by dealer as only they will have mutt2.
They'll have your manifolds off to do tappets so have them cleaned up whilst they're at it.. And If were me I'd just change injectors while they're at too... be on safe side, that's just me, cheap insurance as reality with these stupid common rail diesels. Love em but hate them at same time.
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby ag9111 on Tue Oct 24, 2017 6:39 pm

There are units available online that will do a SQL relearn. But if they have the motor pulled apart for manifold, injectors or whatever they have to do it anyway
Come on Steve. Mutt3 is so yesterday that not even the dealers use it anymore.
Do the manifolds come off for a tappet adjustment?
If you have had an EGR blank in from near new then manifolds will not need to be removed for a clean.
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby srb on Tue Oct 24, 2017 7:20 pm

Yeah Garth I don't go to dealers or mechanics so I wouldn't know latest and greatest. That's good know though.
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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby snakesoup on Tue Oct 24, 2017 8:11 pm

Whats a set of injecters worth on these things?

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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby har05l on Tue Oct 24, 2017 11:36 pm

snakesoup wrote:Whats a set of injecters worth on these things?

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Onwards and upwards of $400 each


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Re: Injectors R/S at 102000ks?

Postby Bammo on Wed Oct 25, 2017 2:08 pm

ag9111 wrote:If you have had an EGR blank in from near new then manifolds will not need to be removed for a clean.


Yep - I've had a blank in since about 7000kms. For the first maybe 20,000ks of that I had the 8mm hole drilled but then switched to a full blank which is how it has been for the past 70,000kms.

My local mechanic reckons the manifold was pretty filthy and the dealer says it needs to be done since that is the thing most likely causing the surging.

I'm going to drop the fuel tank and do that and the filters myself. I was going to do the manifold myself but the dealer indicated both the upper and the lower needed to be done - anyone removed the lower themselves?
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